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Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author arfrever
Full name Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
Date 2009-11-12 21:34:36 PST
Message 2009-11-09 16:10:06 Greg Stein napisał(a):
> Hi all,
>
> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/

-1

> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

+1

> In our discussion with the ASF Infrastructure Team, they have no
> preference on which we choose. Both are equally supported.
>
> For completeness:
>
> 3) Stick to Issuezilla on tigris.org

-0

> 4) Use the issue tracker on Google Code in <some> appropriate project.
> [this is my favorite tracker!]

-1

> 5) Set up our own tracker on ASF hardware (eg. Trac). [I do not
> recommend this; our project would have to maintain it; ASF Infra only
> maintains Jira/Bugzilla]

-1

--
Arfrever Frehtes Taifersar Arahesis
Attachments

RE: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author rhuijben
Full name Bert Huijben
Date 2009-11-10 06:35:46 PST
Message > -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Stein [mailto:gstein at gmail dot com]
> Sent: maandag 9 november 2009 16:10
> To: dev at subversion dot tigris dot org
> Subject: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?
>
> Hi all,
>
> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.

I leave this to others to decide.


> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/

+0 .. It is a commercial product, but I heard a lot of good things about it.

> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

-0. A long time ago I didn't like bugzilla. And I have something against big
perl projects. Bugzilla survived a long time though.

> For completeness:
>
> 3) Stick to Issuezilla on tigris.org

-0.
I don't think we should keep this on tigris, but it could stay there for a
bit longer if the other option would be to convert twice.

> 4) Use the issue tracker on Google Code in <some> appropriate project.
> [this is my favorite tracker!]

+0. I like the simpilicity, but I don't think using google code for just the
issuetracker is what we want.

> 5) Set up our own tracker on ASF hardware (eg. Trac). [I do not
> recommend this; our project would have to maintain it; ASF Infra only
> maintains Jira/Bugzilla]

I like Traq, but I think we should leave the management to another team, so
this would be a -0 too.

So, no real vote from me on this RFC.

    Bert

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author stylesen
Full name Senthil Kumaran S
Date 2009-11-10 00:26:52 PST
Message Greg Stein wrote:
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

+1 for Bugzilla which is completely free software and also has 3+ years more
experience than Jira ;)

--
Senthil Kumaran S
http://www.stylesen.org/

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author gavinbaumanis
Full name Gavin Baumanis
Date 2009-11-09 21:08:16 PST
Message +1 for Bugzilla.

As long as it operates as required. otherwise I would vote to staying
at tigris.org with Issuezilla.
While I think it is desirable to have "all" parts at Apache - we
should ensure that we don't lose any functionality.
(Of course I am not saying that we will.)


Gavin.


On 10/11/2009, at 02:10 , Greg Stein wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/
>
>
> In our discussion with the ASF Infrastructure Team, they have no
> preference on which we choose. Both are equally supported.
>
> For completeness:
>
> 3) Stick to Issuezilla on tigris.org
>
> 4) Use the issue tracker on Google Code in <some> appropriate project.
> [this is my favorite tracker!]
>
> 5) Set up our own tracker on ASF hardware (eg. Trac). [I do not
> recommend this; our project would have to maintain it; ASF Infra only
> maintains Jira/Bugzilla]
>
>
> For all options, other than (3), we will get a data dump of Issuezilla
> from tigris.org (via XML export, or SQL datadump) and coax that into
> the new tracker. I believe we can keep the same issue numbers in all
> cases.
>
>
> Lastly: note that since we are not required to use ASF hardware, the
> move to a new issue tracker is not a requirement for Incubator
> graduation. While I hope to see us graduate in about 7 weeks, we can
> take several months to get the issue tracker migration Done Right.
>
> Please provide your thoughts and comments. If there is no clear
> direction, then we'll run a poll on the topic.
>
> Cheers,
> -g
>
> --------------------​--------------------​--------------
> http://subversion.ti​gris.org/ds/viewMess​age.do?dsForumId=462​&dsMessageId=241​5808

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author e_wong
Full name Edmund Wong
Date 2009-11-09 16:56:04 PST
Message Greg Stein wrote:
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

I think the bug tracker that closely resembles the current
issue tracker that Subversion employs would be the best
choice since users have the 'feel' already. That's my
comment.

I've never used Jira; but, I have used Bugzilla but
that was a while back. FWIW, I'm going to say Bugzilla.

So, as they say, +1 for Bugzilla.

Edmund

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author brane
Full name Branko Cibej
Date 2009-11-09 09:45:39 PST
Message Greg Stein wrote:
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/
>

Having used both on fairly large projects ... well, Jira scalability
isn't, and Bugzilla has its own set of weirdos. But since I've yet to
see a /good/ issue tracking system, and I have a number of unprintable
private opinions about Jira, so ...

+1 Bugzilla, I have fond memories of hacking you into subservience.

-- Brane

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author dlr
Full name Daniel Rall
Date 2009-11-09 09:34:13 PST
Message On Monday, November 9, 2009, Justin Erenkrantz <jerenkrantz at apache dot org> wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Ivan Zhakov <ivan at visualsvn dot com> wrote:
>> Closed-source shouldn't be problem since JIRA Enterprise Edition comes
>> with *full* source code and I'm sure that ASF Infrastructure Team has
>> access to them.
>
> Interesting - at Apache, I'm pretty sure we do not have access to the
> JIRA source code; but, I think a few of our committers have indirect
> access through other means.  To be fair, Atlassian has tried to
> provide support; but the scalability characteristics of JIRA are still
> a mixed bag.  -- justin

Indeed they are.

+1 for Bugzilla.

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author jerenkrantz
Full name Justin Erenkrantz
Date 2009-11-09 08:29:23 PST
Message On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Ivan Zhakov <ivan at visualsvn dot com> wrote:
> Closed-source shouldn't be problem since JIRA Enterprise Edition comes
> with *full* source code and I'm sure that ASF Infrastructure Team has
> access to them.

Interesting - at Apache, I'm pretty sure we do not have access to the
JIRA source code; but, I think a few of our committers have indirect
access through other means. To be fair, Atlassian has tried to
provide support; but the scalability characteristics of JIRA are still
a mixed bag. -- justin

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author fugazi
Full name Larry Shatzer
Date 2009-11-09 08:20:56 PST
Message On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 9:13 AM, Ivan Zhakov <ivan at visualsvn dot com> wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Greg Stein <gstein at gmail dot com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
>> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
>> to use.
>>
>> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
>> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
>> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
>> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
>> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>>
>> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>>
>> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>>
> My vote is +1 for JIRA: it's commercial product with good enough
> quality. It's highly customizable.
>
> Closed-source shouldn't be problem since JIRA Enterprise Edition comes
> with *full* source code and I'm sure that ASF Infrastructure Team has
> access to them.

The open source license that ASF has does not come with the source.
You need to be a paying customer to get access to that.

-- Larry

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author Ivan Zhakov <ivan at visualsvn dot com>
Full name Ivan Zhakov <ivan at visualsvn dot com>
Date 2009-11-09 08:13:40 PST
Message On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Greg Stein <gstein at gmail dot com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
My vote is +1 for JIRA: it's commercial product with good enough
quality. It's highly customizable.

Closed-source shouldn't be problem since JIRA Enterprise Edition comes
with *full* source code and I'm sure that ASF Infrastructure Team has
access to them.

--
Ivan Zhakov
VisualSVN Team

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author hwright
Full name Hyrum K. Wright
Date 2009-11-09 08:09:26 PST
Message On Nov 9, 2009, at 10:06 AM, Justin Erenkrantz wrote:

> On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 4:10 PM, Greg Stein <gstein at gmail dot com> wrote:
>> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/
>
> +1 for Bugzilla.
>
> We can arrange a separate instance so our issue numbers are preserved.
> If so, that'd be nice ; but I wouldn't be terribly upset if we lost
> the numbers... -- justin

I dunno: there's so much history in names like 3242. It'd be a shame
to lose that. :P

-Hyrum (who actually doesn't care, so long as logical links are
preserved.)

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author jerenkrantz
Full name Justin Erenkrantz
Date 2009-11-09 08:06:25 PST
Message On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 4:10 PM, Greg Stein <gstein at gmail dot com> wrote:
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

+1 for Bugzilla.

We can arrange a separate instance so our issue numbers are preserved.
 If so, that'd be nice ; but I wouldn't be terribly upset if we lost
the numbers... -- justin

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author markphip
Full name Mark Phippard
Date 2009-11-09 07:57:15 PST
Message On Mon, Nov 9, 2009 at 10:10 AM, Greg Stein <gstein at gmail dot com> wrote:

> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

The GoogleCode option is kind of interesting, but it does not feel
right for some reason to have our issue tracker not on Apache.

My vote would be for Bugzilla. It is open-source (which ought to be
important to all of us), and obviously it is similar to IssueZilla.

--
Thanks

Mark Phippard
http://markphip.blogspot.com/

Re: [RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author cmpilato
Full name C. Michael Pilato
Date 2009-11-09 07:50:27 PST
Message Greg Stein wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
> project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
> to use.
>
> I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
> facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
> original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
> advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
> possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.
>
> The ASF provides two bug trackers:
>
> 1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/
>
> 2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/

As long as we have the option, I *strongly* favor using open-source software
(unless doing so causes an unnatural burden due to software suckage).
Unless I'm mistaken, that rules out Jira.

> Lastly: note that since we are not required to use ASF hardware, the
> move to a new issue tracker is not a requirement for Incubator
> graduation. While I hope to see us graduate in about 7 weeks, we can
> take several months to get the issue tracker migration Done Right.

Agreed -- let's take the time to do this right the first time.

--
C. Michael Pilato <cmpilato at collab dot net>
CollabNet <> www.collab.net <> Distributed Development On Demand
Attachments

[RFC] which bug tracker to use?

Author gstein
Full name Greg Stein
Date 2009-11-09 07:10:12 PST
Message Hi all,

Now that we're in the Incubator and on our way to becoming an Apache
project, one of the items that we need to select is which bug tracker
to use.

I'll preface this with: the ASF does not *mandate* that we use its
facilities for bug tracking. It only wants source control and the
original distribution point to be on ASF hardware. I'm not necessarily
advocating that we keep a separate tracker (user confusion), but it is
possible. Weigh the pros/cons in your mind.

The ASF provides two bug trackers:

1) Jira at http://issues.apache.org/jira/

2) Bugzilla at http://issues.apache​.org/bugzilla/


In our discussion with the ASF Infrastructure Team, they have no
preference on which we choose. Both are equally supported.

For completeness:

3) Stick to Issuezilla on tigris.org

4) Use the issue tracker on Google Code in <some> appropriate project.
[this is my favorite tracker!]

5) Set up our own tracker on ASF hardware (eg. Trac). [I do not
recommend this; our project would have to maintain it; ASF Infra only
maintains Jira/Bugzilla]


For all options, other than (3), we will get a data dump of Issuezilla
from tigris.org (via XML export, or SQL datadump) and coax that into
the new tracker. I believe we can keep the same issue numbers in all
cases.


Lastly: note that since we are not required to use ASF hardware, the
move to a new issue tracker is not a requirement for Incubator
graduation. While I hope to see us graduate in about 7 weeks, we can
take several months to get the issue tracker migration Done Right.

Please provide your thoughts and comments. If there is no clear
direction, then we'll run a poll on the topic.

Cheers,
-g
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